Scott Linklater

Interview With Scott Linklater

Bill: Hey, it’s Bill McIntosh here and we are back with another expert who has been running some really cool Facebook video ad campaigns and he is social media expert, Scott Linklater from Australia. Welcome! Hey, Scott!

Scott: Hey, Bill. Thanks very much for having me.

Bill: Yeah, I’m glad you joined me and I really appreciate you spending the time to share your stuff. It’s not often someone is just willing to share what’s working.

Scott: My pleasure, happy to help out.

Bill: Yeah, let me give you a little intro. When I first talked to you, I thought you were doing some cool stuff actually with art, as well as a few other things. Let’s dive into that first. Can you talk about what you did there and some results that you got?

Scott: Yeah, sure. I’ve got a business separate from my social media company that my sister runs and it’s an art gallery. We specialize in local, indigenous, Australian Aboriginal art. Obviously being involved in the social media, we set some stuff up with that as well. It’s a really interesting market because it’s traditionally, it’s a little bit tougher in that market than a lot of the other things that people are running within social media, so we’ve had to work a little bit harder to get it to work, but we’ve got some really good results. About a year ago, we started experimenting with video ads and videos within posts and so forth to see how that would impact on the results of the page. We found it worked really, really well. Art is another tricky thing to do because in video the art never looks very good, it’s always going to be fairly pink slanted, it’s certainly not going to be as sharp as you want it to be, but what you can do with video in the art industry is that in 60 seconds you can show 25 different pieces of artwork and if one of them takes someone’s fancy, then they’re going to click through to the website and look at the large images, the static images, which is what you want them to do. We found it was good, rather than just putting up a picture of one image, which is only going to appeal to a small amount of people, if we could put a 60-second video up with 25 or 30 in there, well, something’s going to appeal to someone, or everyone in there.

Bill: Sounds like a great idea. It’s essentially like a slide show showing a bunch of different pieces and then do you put music to it or something or tell me about the video?

Scott: We’re doing a lot with Animoto, which is really easy, so we just drag in the images, put in on the bottom or in between some text, grab one of their licensed pieces of music for the background, produce it and upload it to Facebook. Yeah, it’s almost like a video slideshow pretty well, yeah, absolutely.

Bill: Wow, that’s awesome and easy to do.

Scott: It’s really easy to do, yes. We’ve been able to produce quickly a lot of neutral topics and that really definitely helps as well, yeah.

Bill: What’s the sales process like on one of those? Do they come to the website and typically buy there? Do they call? Do they show up in person?

Scott: Yes.

Bill: How does that happen?

Scott: Really good question. The buyer side in Aboriginal art is extremely long, up to 90 days from when they first have contact with you to when they will buy because number one, art, we sell paintings for as little as $50-100, but our average sale would be upward of $750-800 and we sell paintings up to $150,000. It’s not a decision that people make wildly and it usually takes a little while for them to come to that decision, so what we find is that they’ll come to the website, they’ll go away and they’ll come back. Then at some stage they may very well ring the gallery and speak to someone. If they do, that’s how I’ll convert, because if they ring, we find that we can usually help them out. But they’ll go to the website and then they’ll come back and that’s why we’re targeting and it’s so important and I can share a little bit about what we’ve done, what we’re targeting as far as the videos are concerned as well because that’s really helped us because we’ve been able to get such high amounts of views quickly and easily. It’s not necessarily them watching the video initially that we’re after, it’s the follow up and it’s that fact that when we hit them the next time with an ad or a post, they know who we are now, we’re not a stranger.

Bill: It’s not just a random art gallery they saw something, it’s like, “Oh, I remember.”

Scott: I watched a video of them last week or last month or whatever. Even if they watched 20 seconds, it’s still that—they know who you are. The difference that makes is phenomenal. That familiarity with the brand or with the business, it makes a huge amount of difference.

Bill: So with your process, do you ever get people to actually come in physically into the store, to like close the deal and make the final purchase?

Scott: Like I said, we do have people, we sell probably more through the gallery than we do actually online, but the thing is that the gallery is located in a remote part of Australia so unless you’re going there for a holiday—it’s in a holiday area—so people are going there specifically to holiday in that area and then they’re coming in and visiting the gallery there. Nobody is sitting online and then going, “I might take a trip down there,” because it’s literally—I can’t begin to tell you how far, I mean, it’s two-and-a-half thousand miles from where I am now. It’s like literally on the other side of the country in the middle of nowhere. That’s why we rely really heavily on people buying online. Even if you came to Australia, you’re not really by there. You’d have to specifically go to that area and so that’s a real niche market in itself, so, yeah.

Bill: I think there’s a lesson there for some people that might have a physical business selling a particular kind of niche or interesting product and they might be kind of fixated on that foot traffic and the local area. Look, there’s an example of selling art for up to $100,000 and you’re closing the deals and doing the whole thing online. They’re physically not going to drive 2,000 miles to your location.

Scott: That’s right. The other thing is that the local community, the people in and around where the gallery is located that live there, they’re not the people that are interested at all. I mean, it’s the people that visit there and it’s people from all around the world. The best thing about the physical location is it provides really, really good social proof, if you want to call it social proof, is that people like the fact that they can see that there is an actual physical place, there’s a shop, there’s a gallery there, rather than just someone selling online from your bedroom or from a warehouse or whatever. So we use that really heavily in video as well. We take a camera and we walk around the gallery as if you are looking at it through your own eyes and just looking at all the different paintings on the wall and so it’s like a first person point of view video. They get the idea as if they were actually in the video. We find that that works great because they’re just seeing pictures on a website, but now they’re actually seeing, okay, those pictures are actually hanging in a gallery on a wall. That works really well.

Bill: Awesome. Like I said, I think there’s a lesson there. I’ll bet to somebody who is going to watch this video, will have a physical business, they’ve been focusing on their local market and they just never thought, I could use video ads to sell my products to anyone, they don’t have to be in your local market.

Scott: Absolutely. Great ideas come from necessity, so yeah.

Bill: I don’t know if you have any numbers at hand there, but what do you think is probably the highest ticket piece you’ve probably sold through video ads. I don’t know if you have any, if you know offhand.

Scott: I know one of the, and this is really interesting, one of the first video ads we ran was during a stock tag sale that we had, so it was a planned sale and we emailed out to our list and so forth, but in conjunction we went flat out with the video ads. I think we sold a four-and-a-half thousand dollar painting in the second day that we were running them, and that through our analytics that we looked at, that came directly through from a view off the video. So all the paintings that we had in this stock tag sale we put into a video slideshow and then pumped it out on Facebook. Both mobile and desktop so we had someone come through that clip, watch the video, go through to the website and then came back the next day and then bought that painting. That’s 3000% above our average sale. But that doesn’t happen every day, but if we can do one of them a month, it’s fantastic!

Bill: No, that’s phenomenal, that’s phenomenal.

Scott: I think I saw instead was what I saw, which was really interesting, because we’d seen through a lot longer video ads was we actually put in the headline of that video, “Stock Tag Sale,” so we put sale in there and I know a lot of people think that “sale” and “sales” is a dirty word. The result that we got, same market, but just putting it clearly that it was for a stock tag sale, the results were— average view time was double and the numbers were through the roof, just by putting sale in there. Even though other videos we ran afterwards were probably as good, if not better quality videos and had better pictures and what have you in them—and they still did really well—but these we went and put stock tag sale in, did phenomenally well. I couldn’t believe it. I was hesitant to even put that word in there, because it was for a sale, I thought, well, I’ve got to say it. The results were, I mean, we had an average view time of 50% on a 3-1/2 minute video, which is just unheard of.

Bill: Wow, that’s cool. I know on almost every type of marketing I’ve done, the minute you have some sort of incentive tied to a time limitation, it just does something magical to making people make those buying decisions and a sale is a perfect tool to do it.

Scott: Absolutely. You know what? It doesn’t matter what industry. The art industry considers themselves very different but we operate very differently than the stock standard art gallery, but I’ve found being a background in sales, it’s the same anywhere, it doesn’t matter. People want a good deal and if you’ve got something that will sell, then they’re going to—you know what? I found the more money people have got to spend, the more likely that they are that they want that deal. It’s just the way it is. Because art galleries generally don’t have sales and don’t discount and things like that. We found that to be just ridiculous. I mean, our sales go extraordinarily well because people want a good deal.

Bill: Well, it’s marketing basics and I think all the guys that are sticking their head in the sand pretending that basic marketing doesn’t work for their business, they’re losing out.

Scott: Definitely.

Bill: Cool. In doing the ads for the galleries, were there any kind of best practices you’ve learned for those style ads and what’s working for you, whether it’s the way you’re setting up the ad, the video, any other stuff you want to share that’s a best practice?

Scott: Absolutely. The most important thing that we’ve learned is the shorter the better and when it’s as short as you think you can possibly make it, cut it in half again because the thing that we found out is, I mean, if you’re Coca Cola or you’re a big brand and people watch your video and still, even if you’re a little brand, it’s good if people watch a bit of your video and associate with it. But what you really want them to do is you want them to act on that call of action that you have at the end of the video. Now, if nobody gets to the end of the video, nobody is acting on that call of action, which is usually to go through to your website. What we found is that even if you’ve got the best quality on your video, keep it to 30, 45, 60 seconds, no more. Otherwise people aren’t going to get through and see your call to action there. If you can keep it to 30 seconds, you’ve got a huge shot at getting a lot more people to the end. I look at our stats and on one video we had like 500 people made it to halfway through the video and then 254 made it to the end. If I had halved that video length and got all of them there, I would’ve done a heck of a lot more business. You got to be brutal and it’s really difficult. You look at it and you go, there’s no more I can cut out of that video. You got to go away and try and cut it in half again. We ended starting with like three-and-a-half, four, five-minute videos and now we’re down to like 45, 50 seconds because it’s just imperative that they get through to the end. We found it doesn’t matter how good your content is, most of them will drop off within that 30-second period of time. If you can finish the video before they go, “I’m out of here,” and it’s not because your video is no good, it’s just the way it is these days with people, they have a very short attention span. If you can beat them to the end, there’s a great chance they’ll get to the end and they’ll click, they’ll click through. Number one, most important thing, keep it short. The second thing that we found is run video ads to your fans, to your own fans, and also to your website visitors. The most phenomenal results we’ve had have been when we run actual paid ads to our own fans. Because obviously they were already familiar with us. We also ran video ads to people that had visited our website, they did exceptionally well because also not all of them knew about us on Facebook, through the custom audience, they got presented something, an ad, a video ad by us on Facebook and they were like, “Hey, I know that gallery, I’ve been to their website.” We found that the numbers were double compared to cold traffic. I think the most underutilized thing on Facebook, people go, “Are fans valuable anymore?” Fans are so valuable it’s not funny. They will convert 2-30 times more than cold traffic, so I think people are saying that there’s no value in our fan pages anymore. They’re extraordinarily valuable, so, yeah. Don’t forget them. A lot of people will just run it to cold traffic.

Bill: What you’re saying goes contrary to what you’ll have so-called experts in social media that I’ll try to convince people that it’s pointless to build fans today and that’s a load of BS. I mean, I agree with you, fans are really important.

Scott: Yeah. What we’ve done is we’ve built a lot of fans up through ads as well and then we run ads to them. People go, “But you shouldn’t have to pay to reach your fans.” I don’t care, because it’s so cheap and easy and the results are so good. I’m not going to cut my nose off to spite my face and that’s what most people are doing. So, keeping it short, running it to fans, definitely putting something in about the sales, have a really, really strong call to action. At the end of the video, you’ve got to tell them exactly what you want them to do and send them to an appropriate landing page, but just make sure that at the end of that video that you’ve got a really strong call to action because otherwise, instead of clicking through to where you want them to go, they’ll go somewhere else. We found that the click-through rate for some people that have been getting us on Facebook, but have been to our website, found us on Facebook or we found them through a custom audience, they then click back through it from normally high rates. That led to lots and lots of sales. Yeah, that works really, really well.

Bill: An important thing I wanted to call to attention is what you mentioned earlier about the fact that some of the art sales have a longer sales cycle and you have a person that sees your thing on your Facebook video ad and then maybe visits your website and sometimes maybe they don’t even visit your website, they just play the video in Facebook and then maybe later, they finally make it to the site and then maybe they have to come back again a week later and then finally eventually become a sales prospect and they close the deal. What I want to point out is if you weren’t trying to, through retargeting and some of the really cool things you can do with custom audiences in Facebook, if you weren’t doing that stuff, those would all be lost sales, you’d never close any of them.

Scott: It’s unbelievable how much business would be lost. We can see from our Google Analytics and also from our Facebook stats, the massive difference that remarketing and retargeting makes. It’s a difference between success and not really in a lot of businesses. We do a lot to make sure we put, any potential customers would put us front and center most days. They’ll see something and it really makes a difference because we can see that we get a lot of indirect, through our Google Analytics, we can see where they’ve been, they’ve seen something of ours and then they’ve come back and bought. The sales cycle can be up to 90 days, so if we’re not front of mind, then they’ll potentially go somewhere else, but because we are, often then they’ll certainly come to us. The other thing that we’ve done with the retargeting is going down to specific artists, or brands, if you want to call them, and run videos and then follow-up ads about it, because we know that they’re specifically interested in that artist. We can take their 15 paintings, they might have 10 or 15 paintings that we have of theirs, drop it into an Animoto video in 15 minutes, run it as an ad, and they’re going to see only paintings that they’re interested in from the artist that they’re interested in and that works really well as well. We found that with the video ads, if we follow up with like a multi-product ad for a specific artist or a specific category or we just follow up with a normal Facebook ad targeted to the people that we know viewed X-amount a period of time of that video, the results are great. If you have someone viewed your video for 30 seconds and then you run an ad specifically to them about what they saw in that video, the click-through rates are phenomenal.

Bill: Well, it’s almost like, from what you’re describing, what I’m thinking about is, it’s almost like you’re building a funnel, but it’s an ad funnel. Most people think about funnels being like, “Oh, you have a squeeze page or you get their email and then they go to a sales page and then you drive them deeper.” You’ve essentially created an ad funnel that sits in front of your sales process.

Scott: Right.

Bill: It seems like the front end of the ad funnel really is the video ads. It’s building branding, it’s getting attention, it’s getting traffic, making some sales. But then now, you’re able to then, now using the tools that Facebook gives you for retargeting, now you can come back and hit them with an engagement ad or hit them with a multi-product ad. You have all this follow up and follow through you can do. It becomes a funnel in front of a funnel, basically.

Scott: That’s a really good way of looking at it because you look at Ryan Deiss and people like that who I’ve trained under and then talk about the funnel, it’s really, the first couple of steps are for them to get familiar and know who you are before you hit them with your core offer. You don’t just hit them in the beginning, you want them to get to know you and before you get them to buy what you want to buy. It is exactly like what you said, even if they’ve only watched a few seconds of your video, when they see the follow-up ad, it’s still something that goes off in their mind, “I know who these people are, this is familiar to me,” and we can see it in the click-through rates doubling. Even if they’ve only watched 35 seconds of a 2-minute video, we find that if we run ads to them after that, they’ll click through at an even higher rate, certainly higher than cold traffic. That’s really what all this comes down to, is getting them familiar with you, in anyway you can, whatever way you can. Video works really well because it’s hot at the moment, people will watch them and Facebook is looking after people that are running video ads. They’re giving a boost, the numbers are great, and if you are prepared to just run them, they will look after you. Certainly at the moment they are looking after people running video ads in a big way.

Bill: Well, there’s something you said, before we turned the camera on we were chit-chatting, and you talked about all the ground that Facebook is getting on YouTube and that’s who’s in their sights. They’ve got that sight trained on YouTube, they want to go head to head with Google and YouTube really and that’s what they’re trying to do. They’ve seen YouTube have all the success with their video ad offering and that’s what they’re going for. They’re incentivizing and they’re working really hard to get as many advertisers into video ads, they’re making them as cheap as possible. I think this is like a window of opportunity where it won’t be this easy in a year or two from now, it won’t be the same.

Scott: 100% correct, so it’s make hay while the sun shines because in a year and a half or a year’s time when everybody is on that bandwagon, they won’t be doing as many favors for video advertisers, so there’s definitely an opportunity there, for sure.

Bill: I’m sure they’ll work continuously, the same with all the different types of Facebook marketing and Facebook ads, they’re all still working. They may not be working as awesomely as they were when they first roll them out, but all of them work. I use almost every tactic that I used to use in Facebook two years ago, I’m still using it. It does still work, it just won’t be as easy. It’s like free money basically right now.

Scott: Yeah, it really is, no doubt about it. You’re 100% correct, yeah.

Bill: Cool! Let’s switch gears a little bit and we’ll move off of the art gallery. I know you’ve done some other stuff with fan pages and I think you’ve even worked for a bunch of clients with a lot of different products, so let’s move over into kind of that realm of other stuff that you’ve done.

Scott: We’ve done a lot of videos for clients just promoting product launches and that kind of thing. Again, what we found is if we can keep the videos really, really short and punchy and have a really good call to action, they work extremely well. Like anything on Facebook, what we’ve also found is passion is the number one thing. If you can get a video that ignites passion within that market, within that group, it is phenomenal what can happen with that, coupled with the fact that Facebook is really looking after you. We’ve got a couple of fan pages that are for sports teams, for local Australian sports teams and one of them, it’s only three-and-a-half dozen fans, it’s not big, but they’re passionate people and we get really great results with anything that we post out. Don’t you have like one ad where you got crazy cheap views? I don’t know if you want to talk about that one or—

Scott: What we did was—and it’s a fan page, but it’s a business, we lead them to different products and so forth that we can sell them. Because we’re doing well with other Facebook video ads, we thought, let’s try a video ad with these guys, with a call to action at the end to send them to the shop. I mean, it wasn’t exactly congruent, because it was more passionate to show, like I said, they were playing a particular team and we put a highlights video together of all the times in the past where we had beaten that team. It just happens to be with this particular team, we’ve beaten a number of times like by one point, like really, really close. So we put all that together into a video and sent it out there and it went so well that we were getting video views for less than half a cent in Facebook, so I rounded it down to zero. I’ve got some to show you, I’ll just click on here and see if we can get it up. You can see here, we got a 1,071 video views for a reach of 2,352, 376 clicks, but you can see the cost is zero per video view. Now obviously it wasn’t exactly zero, but it was so low that Facebook’s automated system read it as zero and a 15% click-through rate. We’ve got some other stats here, so we’ve got 1,071 video views for a $4.77 spend. We’ve got 44 likes out of that and I didn’t close comments, it’s probably run out of actions, but what we got was phenomenal amount of engagement. What it did was it led to more sales that week. I mean, we spent $4.77, if we had sole 1 item at $55, we’re way up front, but we sold much more than that, so it worked. It worked really, really well. You’re not going to get these figures all the time, but it shows you what’s possible when you combine a passionate market with a passionate video ad and that’s what’s possible. It’s pretty crazy what can be done.

Bill: Thanks for sharing that. I don’t know if you tracked your ROI on that one, but for $4 spend, ROI must have been nuts.

Scott: About $350 in sales direct, we think. There might have been more because it keeps working down the track. People find the link and they go back, but directly off of that in the 3 or 4 days around that, we sold $455 worth of products and probably made about $250, which is not bad. It’s only a little fan page and we don’t promote it hard for the sales, it’s just a very, 20-mintues-a-week part-time thing. So yeah, really good. I was really happy with the video results and people loved it. I mean, I know it’s easier with something like that, but if you can just find something that relates to your niche, whatever it is, that gets them really passionate, then you’ll find that they’ll share it, they’ll watch it, they’ll like it, they’ll talk about it. We proved with that video it doesn’t have to be congruent right through the offer. That was something a little bit left of field and then at the end it was like, “Hey, come and check out these products,” but those that come to the end, they did that. It worked without necessarily following what I would say is the normal path or the right path.

Bill: Well, that strategy can work. It has to be kind of congruent, it can’t be like, you show them a football team and then you’re moving them off to go buy bikinis or something.

Scott: Yeah, it was specific enough, it did the job, yeah.

Bill: But I think that’s a good strategy. Grab their attention with something that would grab their interest or their passion and then segue that into some kind of call to action to get them to make the transaction, I think that’s a great formula.

Scott: Yeah, as good as it was, if I had made it half the length, it would’ve done twice as well.

Bill: With the stuff you were selling, was it like t-shirts and promotional items, that kind of stuff for the team?

Scott: Yeah, merchandise, yeah, exactly. Onesies, you know onesies? [Laughs]

Bill: Oh, yeah!

Scott: We were promoting onesies, key rings, wrist bands, bracelets, stickers, that kind of thing, yeah.

Bill: Okay, cool, not bad. $4 spend, $250 or more in returns.

Scott: Profit, yeah. And ongoing, I mean, I’m sure there was probably more than that, but that’s what we could track directly.

Bill: Okay, awesome. Any other lessons you’ve learned, whether it’s related to targeting or how you actually assemble your ads and the text introduction, anything else that you can cover to kind of pass along some knowledge.

Scott: Sure. Probably the other thing I’ve found is you need to keep the text above the video as short as possible and definitely don’t let it truncate out with that “read more,” because now you’re asking them to click a button to read the rest of the posts and now you’re going to get the ad cranked up and click the video ads, so you definitely don’t want that to happen. Whatever text you have above should be just getting them to click and watch that ad, watch that video, so keep it as brief as possible. I mean, the one big taker I can tell you is just get it shorter, shorter, shorter and as short as you can without diluting your message but I’ve found that we’ve cut out stuff that I thought I can’t cut out and the results are always better the shorter they are, usually down to 30 seconds. That was a big thing and yeah, keeping the text short. Obviously you need to have a video image that’s there before the video that doesn’t have too much text in it, because otherwise they’ll shut your ad down for going over the 20%. We spend a bit of time trying to make sure that the placeholder image is something that’s going to catch people’s attention, even though a lot of the times the video will just start automatically in their feed, some people will see it on their direct page and it won’t—yeah, that’s important as well. Just keep it short and call to action at the end. As far as targeting is concerned, I’ve pretty well just followed exactly the same targeting that I’ve done on regular ads. I know that you were saying that some people have found it a little bit, maybe broader targeting. Pretty well exactly what we’ve done for other ads and I found that that works really well. The other thing, the biggest thing, pics are everything. You’ve got to build in custom audiences from the video, from your landing page, from absolutely everything and grab it all and then work out what to do with those custom audiences from there. You can get so much information from that, so it’s not the first lot of video ads you run or the first little ads you run, it’s the second and third ones where you’re going to make your money. On Google, we do some advertising on that, with Google Adwords, and we find that if we didn’t have retargeting and remarketing, we do both, so we have Google ads that send people to a website that then we retarget them on Facebook. If we didn’t have that, our results would be nowhere near as good. Then when I speak to a lot of my clients, when I’ve got new clients, I speak to other people, they still don’t remarket and retargeting, it’s just like, oh my god, you’re losing so much—

Bill: It sounds confusing and complicated, when you first start talking and trying to learn about how to do it. The fact is, it’s actually really, really easy. It sounds way more complicated than it is. I’m sure people have never done it before, you’re talking about retargeting to the point where you’re catching which artists they’re interested in and then showing them ads just for those artists. Someone’s probably going, “Oh my god, that sounds hard!” It’s not, it’s really easy.

Scott: Right. Even if it was, it’d be worth it. I mean, if you’re going to spend a day trying to learn something new, this would be the thing, like learn video ads and learn retargeting, because it will make a massive difference to your business, it really, really will. If I had to rely on sales that came through the initial channels initially from video ads or different kind of ads, there would be one fee for what they are, once you can add in the retargeting, the video retargeting, and the remarketing, so it makes a big difference.

Bill: Awesome.

Scott: That’s about all the tips I’ve got, but yeah.

Bill: I appreciate it, man. You’ve been an open book, just kind of sharing everything you’ve got and that is really awesome.

Scott: It’s a massive market out there, there’s plenty of room for everybody.

Bill: Great. We’ll end off at this point, any final words you want to say before we shut down?

Scott: Yeah, just jump on board, give them a try. As we said before, there’s a window of opportunity here for Facebook video ads. Once they’re gunning for YouTube, they’re going to be really cheap and really effective, but once they tighten that handle, they might back off a little bit and not be doing so many favors. Probably you’ve got 9 to 12-month window of opportunity now and jump on board, give it a try. The other thing I would say is, when you do the video ads, make sure you’re looking at your stats from a point of view of—you can lie to anyone you want, but don’t lie to yourself, meaning that you can look at some parts of the stats and you can see that they look great, but you really want to look at it is what are the actual results coming out of that? How many people are going to click through, how much business are you generating through that? It’s no good just to have 10-second video views. I mean, it’s still good, it still helps, but it’s not going to be nearly as effective as if you can get 30-40% of people to watch through to the end. I know that sounds low, but that’s actually really high. Then give them an option, you need to act on your call of action. Measure out those things and that’ll tell you where you’re really at with the video ads.

Bill: Awesome. Well, thanks again, Scott.

Scott: My pleasure.

Bill: We’ll wrap up the interview and I’ll talk to you soon. Scott: Thanks very much.